Talk:Miraculous Outcome Goku & Frieza (Final Form) (Angel)/@comment-5462113-20180912060319/@comment-29574285-20180912131951

"Only the original Manga is Canon, everything else is filler."

No, actually. I don't really think that's true at all. The manga isn't the source material for Super like it was in Z. The anime actually came out first and was ahead of the manga for it's entire run. Therefore using what is/isn't in the manga to determine what's cannon is incorrect.

"Super is just a cash grab-"

Irrelevant.

"-which so far hasn't added anything substantial to Dragonball,-"

Opinion.

"-it just rehashed old plots."

Sharing elements =/= rehashing old plots. Just because Fireza is the antagonist in RoF, for example, doesn't mean that arc is just a rehashed Namek. Or even though Goku Black is technically an 'Evil Goku' like Turles or Ginyu, the story of each of those characters is different. Context is important.

"If you wana consider it canon be my guest but its just advertisement,-"

And advertisement for what, the manga? Because no, it isn't. In fact you could argue the reverse is true. Or did you mean that it's just an advertisement for the brand as a whole? Because if so, while yeah that's true, it's also just a really dumb thing to complain about. It's like watching Star Wars Episode 4 and complaing that the movie is just advertisement the Star Wars brand.

"-might as well count the kfc commercial as canon too then."

False equivalency.

"Actually it doesn't, if you look into it it got even more plotholes than GT."

Ignoring that you provided no examples to support this, plot holes do not influence the canonicity of a series in any capacity, nor is it the sole determinate of it's quality.

'"And he doesn't "write" the story, he gives bullet points and ideas, toyotaro and toei write the story, which is an explanation as to why its so bad." '

Whether or not it's bad is subjective. However I'd argue that both forms of Super have some major issues that plague them. The Super anime, for example, definitely takes some logical leaps with it's power levels for characters like Android 17. However, the manga also has it's fair share of issues, with the biggest in my opinion being it's absolutely atrocious pacing, especially in it's current arc. Things like Kale eliminating several universes in a single chapter brings me to question why this is even a multiversal tournament in the first place.

However, in both of these cases, I can look past these issues. Back to my anime example, I'm willing to look past Android 17's ridiculous leap in power because there was at least an attempt to explain it (as weak as it may have been), and 17 is used brilliantly as a character in the arc. At least to me he was, anyway. Looking  at my manga example, I can easily forgive that due to the manga's tight schedule. While fleshing out the other universe a bit like the anime did would be nice, I understand that the manga simply does not have the time to do that.

"Just a shame that they most definitely will force the lazy ultra instinct in it."

Subjective on multiple fronts. And simply having a transformation you don't like in an otherwise good movie shouldn't really ruin the experience.